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b2bwholesaler
Joined: May 30, 2004
# Posts: 14
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Posted: 07/05/2004 06:16 pm
I have had it. I have a successful b2b wholesale site. 18,000 registered buyers and sellers. I have around 50,000 per month, most repeaters . New traffic is generated from the SEngines overseas, trade board posting and Yahoo and MSN. (The business is booming and I am making money.)
Despite my patent on the technology, my competitors continue to try to copy my site. "Slime balls"
What I am posting about it how angry I am that I can't get listed in dgmoz (OVER 1 Year)
I have decided I must be blackballed from dgmoz because a competitor is editing the category. AM I crazy???????
I have already visited the Dmoz newsgroup and told over and over to just wait it could take another year and not to change my category ... while others are getting listed in 1-2 mos. -  sorry I just do not buy it anymore.
If anyone else would like to contact me about ways to beat the DMOZ Monopoly please contact me - I will share my traffic to get Listed in aol, dgmoz ect..
Jane
[url removed]
[ Message was edited by: JimBot 07/12/2004 11:09 pm ]
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dcaff03
Joined: Eons Ago
# Posts: 142
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Posted: 07/05/2004 06:28 pm
Jane...
There is quite a bit of chatter at several different forums right now on this very topic...ODP Editors blocking or sandboxing Web sites that compete with their own properties...or just outright deleting sites that are competing with their own enterprises..
Very serious problem here as we all know that the ODP listings are pulled from because of the their "alleged" relavancy and the fact that a "human" did the review..
There are reports of corruption and backroom deals goings down and although ODP supposedly has some sort of built in system to curb this kind of behaivour...some is bound to make it through unnoticed...no matter what any of the editors/meta editors and whoever from ODP say about this to defend their positions...big problem..
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g1smd
Staff
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10284
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Posted: 07/07/2004 02:41 pm
>> There is quite a bit of chatter at several different forums right now on this very topic... <<
There is, and you should read it more closely...
>> ODP Editors blocking or sandboxing Web sites that compete with their own properties <<
... because it is IMPOSSIBLE for any one editor to block any site being listed...
>> ...or just outright deleting sites that are competing with their own enterprises... <<
... and deletion is called abuse and the editor gets booted out; so that is a rarity too (every edit is logged, and visible to every other editor).
>> Very serious problem here <<
... is that you need to go back and read the information again. Carefully.
>> There are reports of corruption and backroom deals goings down <<
There are always a few bad editors, and when found they are rapidly ex-editors.
>> and although ODP supposedly has some sort of built in system to curb this kind of behaivour <<
It does have many systems, and several of those are available to any member of the public, any external webmaster, anyone at all to use.
>> ...some is bound to make it through unnoticed... <<
I expect that a few do make it through; but I suspect that it accounts for far less than 0.1% of the editing done at the ODP, maybe even 0.01%.
I assume you were thinking about this thread someplace else. Read it again and again until you understand it. Read what is actually said; rather than trying to make it say what you want it to say.
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b2bwholesaler
Joined: May 30, 2004
# Posts: 14
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Posted: 07/07/2004 03:00 pm
Ian,
Can you help me? It seems you are very knowlegeable in this area. I was in the top 3 under closeouts in every search engine for almost 4 years - I have copies of the stats to show my ranking and traffic reached 100,000 unique visitors a month. Now, I changed my site url only and haven't been able to get back in at all!!! Absurd. I branded my company from the exposure alone. Unfortunately I had to change the name of the site (long story)and have been trying to get listed ever since.
Can anyone help me/ I even have been paying 20.00 (now 30.00) a month for a listing in Business.com in hopes DGMOZ would pick up my link but still Nothing..
Please someone contact me if you think you can get me listed. I will pay or run advertising on my site for your company as a trade.
THanks
Jane
[URL sig removed as per TOS, please place your url and company info in your profile and not your post. -The JimWorld Staff]
[ Message was edited by: b2bwholesaler 07/07/2004 03:12 pm ]
[ Message was edited by: JimBot 07/12/2004 11:07 pm ]
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g1smd
Staff
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10284
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Posted: 07/07/2004 03:34 pm
You need to get more incoming links. By dumping a domain and starting again, you really are starting again. Your old links count for nothing - they were to a different site.
There is a ton of stuff that you can do to ensure that your site is the best that it could be, both for your visitors and for search engines. Optimise the title and meta description. Run all the code through the HTML validator. Use headings wisely. Build useful content, stuff that is so interesting that other sites will want to link to it without even asking them.
Don't obsess about an ODP listing. Submit one root domain, to the one best cateogry, then forget all about it; totally. Promote your site in lots of places. Don't rely on one directory or one search engine listing to give you a big pay off. It just doesn't work like that.
Oh, and don't ever approach editors with offers of "stuff"; that can easily get the editor booted, and all your sites black-balled forever.
Getting listed in the ODP can take a long time, or can happen in a few days. That is the way it is when 10 000 editors edit random sites in random categories, only some of which they pick off the site suggestion pile, with the rest coming from their own research elsewhere.
[ Message was edited by: g1smd 07/07/2004 03:44 pm ]
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b2bwholesaler
Joined: May 30, 2004
# Posts: 14
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Posted: 07/07/2004 11:04 pm
Ian,
This sounds like the same canned pitch I have been getting from the editors at dmoz. ARE YOU ONE of the DMOZ editors? If so, you should tell people this in advance since it seems a conflict of interest. You also seem to be very defensive about this subject. I am here ONLY to talk to SEO Professionals who can take a look at my site and give me some unbiased feedback. Something is very suspicious on what is going on here. - now I have to wonder if dmoz is PLANTING Editors in SEO Groups! Too Bad Jim is not around anymore - he would not like this scenario.
For you information, I have been a member here since 1998. In fact I designed my original site from zero members to 18,000 members using members advice in this Forum Group. This was WAY BEFORE books were written on the subject or Classes taught in colleges and maybe even when you were still in Diapers. * I remember watching the sunrise on many occasions after staying up all night studying the techniques and reading the threads on Jim World. I learned so much and I enjoyed the people here more than you will ever imagine. I don't remember YOU or anyone like you. I learned about keywords, metatags and content and I even designed my website from the ground up using the wonderful advice from the group of people I met here. I got up to 100,000 visitors per month and Ian I never paid a penny for any advertising. -- --- AOL closeout #1. MSN #1 Lycos #1 Alta Vista #1
READ CAREFULLY THIS PART-
I changed the name of the site and the url and Everything else remained the same (keywords, title, content, metatags). I relisted. I waited. I politely asked many times the status. I even offered a gift to the editor ( A TOKEN OF APPRECIATION NOT EXPECTING HIM TO ACCEPT BUT HOPING IT MIGHT BE A NICE GESTURE). IT WASN'T A BACK ROOM TYPE OF OFFER - IT WAS ONLINE IN PUBLIC AND INNOCENT - IT HAD ALREADY BEEN ALMOST A YEAR AND I WAS TRYING SO HARD NOT TO GET MAD. I tried to be funny, I tried to be patient, I even offered to become an editor and donate my time for free - (I was never contacted.) I had been a Go Guide before and had plenty of experience but not even a follow up email from Dmoz staff. I even went to the category I was trying to get into - wholesalers, liquidators and I emailed the editor - but again, no response.
I worked as a go guide during the early years so I have contributed my time to the WWW - I try to give back whenever I can - i offer tips and links. I have worked very hard to build an online business. I don't charge any upfront fees. I make money only when I complete a transaction and everyone is happy. So your comments are making me EVEN MORE Suspicious of what is really going on behind the scenes in the Dmoz World. You have so many posts on this subject and you seem very defensive when anyone critizes dmoz.
FYI to answer your canned answer
1. The content and meta tags are exactly the same as before. The incoming links have not changed much since my customer base has moved with me.
My customers are very loyal, my reputation is excellent and I smell a rat at Dmoz.
This is my opinion and unless things have changed around here, I shouldn't have to fear being blackballed by a dmoz editor for speaking my opinion.
Jane
[url removed]
[ Message was edited by: JimBot 07/12/2004 11:10 pm ]
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cbp
Joined: Dec 25, 2003
# Posts: 181
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Posted: 07/08/2004 04:17 am
>I even offered a gift to the editor
You should be blacklisted from DMOZ for doing that. If you are blacklisted, you brought this on yourself.
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b2bwholesaler
Joined: May 30, 2004
# Posts: 14
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Posted: 07/08/2004 07:22 am
An act of kindness should not be a reason to black ball a customer.
I receive gifts, hand written cards, and flowers from my customers and I have never have considered it a bribe to get better positioning on my website. I work very hard and even a thank you is sometimes better than money. In addition, I would never rudely respond back to a customer and threaten to ban him from my site and accuse him of trying to bribe me if he offered a gift. I would simply say "Thank you but it is against our policy."
Back to the real problem....
What do you have to say about everything else in my post? Can you offer me some constructive criticism???
Is it possibly the scrolling banner is keeping the search engine robots from spidering? I have another page I made called [url removed] without the scroller - would this be a better page to submit to search engines or does it make a difference?
I added a dmoz banner to my home page - will this help or will it be considered a bribe? Or will the banner have have no effect?
Does anyone have advice about business.com? Is it worth the money? Can someone recommend a good traffic analyzer - free - or low cost.
I am looking for some help from a SEO Guru who understands my frustration, and who will consider a barter arrangement to held solve my problem and to help me find another angle - perhaps I can change my url again? start listing in local directories. Paying PPC is not an option since I spent hundreds last year on Google and Overture as a temporary way to get into these directories until my submission was approved with Dmoz but my budget is depleted and I have to find other alternative methods.
PS - I have samples of designer handbags and other items on my site that I would be willing to trade for your time and services. And if you want to email me directly that would be great - I don't want to take up more forum space- I know there is alot written on this subject and I have read most all of everything on this site - I am finally reaching out to ask for some one to analyse my particular situation - I don't expect anyone to do it for free and I am willing to pay by barter or would consider cash but only if I get a listing in dmoz.
Thanks and if anyone has questions about wholesale or b2b I am glad to share what I know from hands on experience- I accept credit cards for 3rd party transactions for high volume amounts 00.00 PLUS and never had a credit card dispute or fraudulent card. (I use alot of fraud screen techniques and have a system that works for me). (but I am still learning daily- and do not consider myself a know it all!).
Thanks Jim World for allowing me to share and I hope I didn't offend anyone - I am just very frustrated.. and so I came back "HOME" to get some advice from my old buddies who I consider the Real Pros and who I admire and respect. I know some might still hang out here - maybe in the background. These people built the web by sharing with each other. A process of taking but always giving back - not money but time, experience and tips- I am from that era and I never meant to offend anyone by offering a gift back for time spent helping me.
Jane
[url removed]
[ Message was edited by: b2bwholesaler 07/08/2004 08:29 am ]
[ Message was edited by: b2bwholesaler 07/08/2004 08:51 am ]
[ Message was edited by: b2bwholesaler 07/08/2004 08:58 am ]
[ Message was edited by: JimBot 07/12/2004 11:11 pm ]
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cbp
Joined: Dec 25, 2003
# Posts: 181
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Posted: 07/08/2004 01:21 pm
>An act of kindness should not be a reason to black ball a customer
1. A bribe is a bribe is a bribe - that is enough to get a site blacklisted
2. You are not a customer of DMOZ
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g1smd
Staff
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10284
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Posted: 07/08/2004 03:28 pm
BEFORE:
>> Can you help me? It seems you are very knowlegeable in this area. <<
AFTER:
>> This sounds like the same canned pitch I have been getting from the editors at dmoz. <<
Hmm. How things change when you aren't given the answer that you want to hear.
That isn't a "canned answer"; that is how it really is. Really. It is.
>> ARE YOU ONE of the DMOZ editors? If so, you should tell people this in advance since it seems a conflict of interest. <<
In what way could giving my time freely to answer questions on this forum be a conflict of interest? I have made 2666 posts here. If you think that helping people, for free, is a conflict then I'll just stop posting here; resign from the forum, and let someone else do it.
>> I am here ONLY to talk to SEO Professionals who can take a look at my site and give me some unbiased feedback. <<
I'm not an SEO, heck I am not even a web-designer; but I know more than enough about the subject to have put an informational site in the top 5 listings in Google, with SERPs of over 10 million a while back (oh, and the site has never been submitted or listed at the ODP), and #1 for other keywords in SERPs of only 1 million (and with no dodgy stuff, no black-hat, no people-you-know, no link farms, no redirects, no messing about). When I look at the sites of the so-called professionals that advertise in this local area, I see that many of them actually know very little about coding, very little about search engines, nothing about SEO, nothing about accessibility, or usability, but they do make lots of sites full of graphics and flash, and totally lacking in real content.
>> Something is very suspicious on what is going on here. - now I have to wonder if dmoz is PLANTING Editors in SEO Groups
What is suspicious? It wasn't until I had made almost 2000 posts here that anyone even thought of giving me extra work on this forum, over and above that of just being a regular poster. In fact for the first few months the Admins here kept asking me, I refused. I think you are delusional. I give some straight answers, and you respond with a rant, and accusations. How rude!
>> For your information, I have been a member here since 1998 <<
Oh, Really? I based my reply on:
>> b2bwholesaler -- Joined: 05/30/2004 -- # Posts: 3 <<
on the left. You didn't disclose that in advance.
>> This was WAY BEFORE books were written on the subject or Classes taught in colleges and maybe even when you were still in Diapers. <<
My first website was way back in 1995. At the time it was the only e-text on that particular subject. I was entirely self taught, but I didn't look at forums for many years. I did look at lots of tutorials though, and often wrote to their authors to correct mistakes in them (many of them were also learning as they went along too).
>> I don't remember YOU or anyone like you <<
Just because I wasn't *here*, doesn't mean anything at all. But I do know that I have over 15 000 posts in various forums associated with web-design, and out of those only a few dozen are questions. I have been posting elsewhere a LOT longer than my time here, but my usual web username was already taken when I joined here.
>> So your comments are making me EVEN MORE Suspicious of what is really going on behind the scenes in the Dmoz World. You have so many posts on this subject and you seem very defensive when anyone critizes dmoz. <<
Hmm. There was no ulterior motive in my original help. I am not the one that will review your site. I have no connection with any of the categories that you might have submitted to.
I couldn't actually help you at all to begin with anyway. The ODP is not a listing service for webmasters; and editors don't do "favours"; they just list sites.
I will not "help" any further.
[ Message was edited by: g1smd 07/08/2004 03:52 pm ]
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b2bwholesaler
Joined: May 30, 2004
# Posts: 14
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Posted: 07/14/2004 10:50 am
b2bwholesaler,
I wanted to let you know that I have edited several of your posts for signature self promotion which is a violation of the TOS you agreed to when joining:
http://www.jimworld.com/forums/tos/
"Self promotion is prohibited. The JimWorld forums are designed to be an educational environment. Posters who solicit work within threads, or who make posts for the sole purpose of linking to their own content will be issued an official warning from staff."
JimWorld is an educational community and as such has
very strict rules against self promotion of any kind.
Take a moment to review the TOS you agreed to when you joined:
http://www.jimworld.com/forums/tos/
A warning has been associated with your ID by our system. This warning is part of our 3-strikes policy which is outlined in the TOS. This warning is viewable ONLY by You and our Staff.
Thank you for your cooperation,
The JimWorld Staff
I EMAILED THE ADMINISTRATOR SEVERAL DAYS AGO AND ASKED FOR ALL POSTS TO BE
REMOVED AND TO CLOSE MY MEMBERSHIP. I WAS NOT SELF PROMOTING, MY CUSTOMERS
ARE RETAILERS AND WHOLESALERS, NOT SEARCH ENGINE OPTIMIZERS AND WEBMASTERS,
I WAS SINCERELY TRYING TO GET HELP WITH MY PROBLEM AND ADDED MY LINK SO
ANOTHER MEMBER COULD LOOK AT MY SITE AND TELL ME IF THEY COULD SEE THE
SCROLLER AT THE TOP AND TELL ME IF IT PERHAPS WAS CAUSING THE ROBOTS NOT TO
SPIDER MY WEBPAGE.
I WAS NEVER OFFERED ANY HELP SO I EMAILED IAN AND TOLD HIM TO CLOSE MY
ACCOUNT.
PLEASE DO THIS AND CONFIRM BACK TO ME SO I CAN END THIS. THINGS HAVE REALLY
CHANGED AROUND THERE. I EVEN PAID FOR YOUR SERVICE LAST YEAR AND NEVER USED
IT THIS WAS THE FIRST TIME I LOGGED IN AND ASKED FOR HELP. TOO BAD THINGS
HAVE TURNED INTO A POLICE KIND OF GROUP.
JANE
----- Original Message -----
From: <enforcer@jimworld.com>
To: <sales@janesdeals.com>
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 11:14 PM
Subject: Posting at JimWorld (WARNING)
b2bwholesaler,
I wanted to let you know that I have edited several of your posts for
signature self promotion which is a violation of the TOS you agreed to when
joining:
http://www.jimworld.com/forums/tos/
"Self promotion is prohibited. The JimWorld forums are designed to be an
educational environment. Posters who solicit work within threads, or who
make posts for the sole purpose of linking to their own content will be
issued an official warning from staff."
JimWorld is an educational community and as such has
very strict rules against self promotion of any kind.
Take a moment to review the TOS you agreed to when you joined:
http://www.jimworld.com/forums/tos/
A warning has been associated with your ID by our system. This warning is
part of our 3-strikes policy which is outlined in the TOS. This warning is
viewable ONLY by You and our Staff.
Thank you for your cooperation,
The JimWorld Staff
=======================================================
DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL
This was sent, automatically, from an outbound
only email account at JimWorld.com
=======================================================
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