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excell Moderator
Joined: Mar 19, 2001
# Posts: 14495
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Posted: 09/21/2005 10:37 am
Amazing that they sent this to small website about a couple of lines of hidden text. The URL is mentioned in Matt's blog and they have not taken action to remove it (the hidden text) yet... With so much heavy duty spam in the se results I am amazed that they are bothering to do this. Surely if they can detect it for this small naive site owner that is obviously not using an seo of either black or white (just bad design - heck there is not even an alt attribute in sight) - they could just penalise it to wake them up? - and spend their time cleaning up the real stuff. After all of these years of allowing petty websites with silly hidden text to remain in their index...why give them such special treatment when they have got away with it for so long? They should have just removed them years ago, in accordence with their guidelines. What - is google sitting there being a moral judge and deciding who deserves help as a site owner and who doesn't? There are many websites that are built by folks who know what they are doing and follow the search engine guidelines and build quality websites that google has punished/suppessed with their sandbox thing. (They are NOT spammers) Why spend energy to help jerks that cannot even bother to read about how to build a decent website? |
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philh Joined: Sep 14, 2001
# Posts: 3050
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Posted: 09/21/2005 11:43 am
>>There are many websites that are built by folks who know what they are doing and follow the search engine guidelines and build quality websites that google has punished/suppessed with their sandbox thing. (They are NOT spammers) Why spend energy to help jerks that cannot even bother to read about how to build a decent website? Print it out and frame it! |
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excell Moderator
Joined: Mar 19, 2001
# Posts: 14495
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Posted: 09/21/2005 12:40 pm
LOL - Should I retain my typos with it. But honestly it steams me to see this... Matt referenced a website they had e-mailed that had a very very weak little spam thingo in the form of a couple lines of hidden text on some pages. And they expect us to sit there and send Spam reports detailing horrendous offences, do nothing, reply to nothing and then they have cucumber sandwiches with folks that don't even know to take their advice??? {edit - slight correction} |
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g1smd Moderator
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10060
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Posted: 09/21/2005 02:31 pm
Pfffffttttt!!!!!!!! |
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excell Moderator
Joined: Mar 19, 2001
# Posts: 14495
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Posted: 09/21/2005 02:38 pm
less than one hundred emails to website owners doesn't equate to the hundreds of hours that some folks that care put into educating website owners, other marketers and clients about how to develop search engine friendly websites only to see the likes of google allow, pander (now - with this).......I shall not go on, but I think you understand me. oops - I think I have a bee in my bonnet! |
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g1smd Moderator
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10060
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Posted: 09/23/2005 12:23 pm
Google often do reply to mail, but there is usually a two or three day delay in their reply each time. Most of the time you still get a canned response. |
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Hampstead Joined: Feb 20, 2001
# Posts: 1941
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Posted: 10/12/2005 06:36 am
PR has now been reinstated and site is appearing in results again. No email from Google this time though  |
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g1smd Moderator
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10060
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Posted: 10/12/2005 08:30 am
I see some reports that people are now receiving "Google Warnings" about "hidden text" - looks like "phase 2" has begun. |
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Hampstead Joined: Feb 20, 2001
# Posts: 1941
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Posted: 10/13/2005 06:17 am
I'd be interested to see what Google considers hidden text. Whether it is the simple same colour text as background or whether they are checking css for things like hidden text in the z axis and the like. |
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g1smd Moderator
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10060
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Posted: 10/13/2005 12:23 pm
One person had "dreamweaver typos" where they had deleted the text of the link, but didn't remove the "action". Xenu LinkSleuth found them all, and they were easily corrected. |
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Hampstead Joined: Feb 20, 2001
# Posts: 1941
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Posted: 10/14/2005 02:31 am
Wow - that's another level again. Sloppy coding can get you banned! Where is this being discussed? Do you have a link? |
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g1smd Moderator
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10060
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Posted: 10/14/2005 12:23 pm
It's a very long WMW thread, started just a few days ago. |
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Logan Moderator
Joined: Aug 14, 2002
# Posts: 3749
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Posted: 10/14/2005 02:24 pm
Its on topic so not evil to link to - I assume this one - if not please share if on topic - link] Also, others have posted additional experiences at the TW thread already referenced. No sign of css - yet - imo. |
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g1smd Moderator
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10060
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Posted: 10/14/2005 03:43 pm
That's the right thread, and GoogleGuy just posted in it too. |
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itmgr Joined: Oct 14, 2005
# Posts: 1
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Posted: 10/15/2005 12:29 am
Gogoel Feedback is a start in the right if its true. I swear sometimes I read these forums and just laugh to myself hearing some of the things people come up with about Google. Most times I never comment as I simply observe but I could not resist today. Let me state this before I go further. I am all for quality search results and totally against true spam. The problem however is determining what one person calls search engine quality and spam. Now I am aware of the academic definitions. However, topics like “Ending penalization for putting the key phrase in the title” To even think one should not be able to put on topic key phrases in a title is just plain crazy. Topics about putting down all doorway pages are also crazy. Let’s think about this for a minute. Doesn’t Google want targeted Content? YES. Do they want some junk spam page generator. Problem not and neither do I. But let’s stay on the doorway subject for a minute. For the SEO guys that say all doorways are wrong, I disagree big time. That is considered good marketing as it is targeted content providing your bringing them to a relative product or service. For example, if you’re a searcher looking for home insurance in Atlanta Georgia and a webmaster creates a directory of pages leading to various insurance and related services in that area it is on target for the person doing the search and the website capturing the searcher. This is target marketing. Now I will ruffle a few feathers here I know but with any luck maybe some of you will put on your marketing caps and not just your technical hat because I have news for you its marketing that sells a product or service. This is why Google and others are now internet marketing companies. Don’t fool yourselves, Google makes the majority of decisions by what is going to benefit their $$ the most. They are a business and all about profits. If most of you are honest with yourselves you will say I am problem in this forum to figure something out I don’t know so I can make more profits too. By now there are some of you that are just all upset thinking I’m ticked off. Well let me open your eyes further. If Google was so concerned with quality searches then why do they allow these same practices in PPC? Ahhh… Yes you can have thousands of pages for each keyword provided it’s on topic and relevant. We call this PPC Landing Pages. Now let’s break it down even further. The pages that pay the most are positioned at the top. Where is page quality here? We have now created here a bidding circus where anyone with money can buy their way to the top and anyone without it sits at the bottom or spends all their time in forums wondering what’s next. Google just turns the old head to PPC stuff as they are making plenty for this. So I say to each and everyone of you… Don’t you get it? While I believe that many things done by Google and other serps are good but most are not!! They are for profit. Just take a look at Google who claims they are going to stay a search engine. Lie!! They are turning into more and more a Yahoo portal every day and the very webmasters that helped put them on the map with free content they are now saying, we are big guys now you play the way we want, pay for a lot of targeted traffic or get lost. If we change the rules for organic searches then get inline at the PPC bank. Wake up and smell the roses as to what is ahead. Google has shareholders to answer to now. Its time to find another up and coming search engine and reset your home pages and tell your friends, family and clients to do the same. Sorry folks but the Internet has become a giant Flea Market. It’s just how it is and how it will be. The question is, are you going to be on the outside standing in the sun trying to sell your products and services or inside in the AC paying top dollar for a PPC booth? |
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Hampstead Joined: Feb 20, 2001
# Posts: 1941
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Posted: 10/18/2005 05:23 am
Thanks for that Logan. I'll quickly change my user agent to Googlebot and take a look at the forum  |
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mindsmack Joined: Oct 19, 2005
# Posts: 5
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Posted: 10/19/2005 01:48 pm
Its going to be interesting to see how this is all handled over the coming years. The issue is there are so many sites the have gone offline and are constipated in the search engines. Going to take a LONG time for the pepto bismol to kick in kids! |
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lizardz Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 1394
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Posted: 10/19/2005 02:11 pm
itmgr, this isn't really news, at least to people who realize that google is a for profit enterprise. There will always be a core of google fanatics who accept totally uncritically whatever public relations stuff is being spit out at the moment, or just will not accept that google is a media company. "Sloppy coding can get you banned!" this topic was extensively covered in this summer's bourbon update threads, with the accompanying hysteria such claims brought about. However, if you accepted the premise, fixed the sloppy webmastering, coding etc, the sites came back fine, that's in bourbon, still waiting to see on jagger what the situation is, my early guess is that sloppy link building may get you banned, but there are too many counter examples to put full faith in that claim. The best guess I've seen so far is that this is in fact a google database corruption issue which they have managed to keep out of the spotlight quite effectively, which means: don't panic if you've dropped, wait a week or two to see what changes stick and which don't. |
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twebdonny Joined: Jun 05, 2004
# Posts: 49
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Posted: 10/19/2005 06:33 pm
Sure wish we had been given some clue as to why our site gets penalized. |
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rossendryv Joined: Eons Ago
# Posts: 192
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Posted: 11/01/2005 09:50 am
Hi Excel I guess im one of those jerks Google is helping with a small site. My thoughts on the letter I received from Google is they like my site and the content but there is a page with hidden text which causes the spider to have some technical difficulty and needs to be fixed. In my case yes, i am a jerk becuase i hired part time Jr. programmers to help with the pages and save money. In this case for a large page on the site with software to download, the programmer decided to Embed (hide) all the keywords related to the software without our knowledge. Probably did not think it would be a problem. This page was coded in 2002. Since that time and before the site has enjoyed very high positioning and has kept climbing in the rankings for 100s of keywords. Althought the page did not meet Google guidlines, and was only 1 page out of about 700 pages on site with some hidden text, i think the penalty of completely removing the site for 30 days or more is a little extreme. Why not just remove the page in question. Alot of business hire folks to handle business resulting from the Google index, In the case of a small biz, 30 days and more of very little income can cause big financial problems. Google's actions have seroius effects on peoples lives and they should become more aware of this. I guess one can look at the positive and say atleast we received some communication from Google on the problem because I am sure most sites which are spamming will not receive a letter, thier sites will be completly removed. |
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