beth_lk
Staff
Joined: Jun 23, 2004
# Posts: 1308
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Posted: 2008-Jan-16 04:33
I just want to be sure I have this right. The links BACK to me does not help me - correct?
It is the sites MY site links to that really matters - correct?
I am asking as I have looked and looked at sites on my subject which is highly competitive ( weight loss ) and 95% or more of those sites do not offer to give a link back to MY site.
Do I need permission to link to someone else's site?
I feel like a greenhorn all over again - in the years past, I never had this issue, as I was always in a very non competitive field and people asked me for links and asked to post back to my sites - this subject area of weight loss seems to be a whole different "game" 
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Prowler
Staff
Joined: Aug 14, 2000
# Posts: 1829
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Posted: 2008-Jan-16 06:43
>> Do I need permission to link to someone else's site?
No.
>> The links BACK to me does not help me - correct?
If you mean - the inbound links to your site - It sure helps you - subject to the condition that it is free ( and not paid for or tagged with rel="nofollow" and comes from thematically related site).
Surely you won't be asking us this. Now what am I missing here, Beth ?
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animated3d
Joined: Dec 22, 2005
# Posts: 443
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Posted: 2008-Jan-16 08:32
as far as i know incoming links are more important then from te site outgoing links because they show the value of the site when others link to it.
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Quadrille
Joined: Nov 15, 2000
# Posts: 1064
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Posted: 2008-Jan-16 11:31
Incoming links (backlinks, links back to you), are vital - they enable Google to calculate your page rank (NOT the green bar page rank), which is an essential part of 'valuing' your site relative to others in your niche.
Outgoing links (the last SEO secret), are important because they help Google to gauge the authority of your site.
Both are important for efficient spidering of your site and your niche - essential if Google is to visit frequently and update relative site 'values'.
Paidlinks, links to bad neighbourhoods, reciprocal links to non-related sites, can all contribute to special treatment for your site - which may include link devaluation or even a Google ban.
You certainly do not need permission for a simple link to another site - but if that site is related and a quality site, and might conceivably link back to you, then a note saying "I've linked to you, I hope that's OK?" just might end up with a return link - while a request for such a link will usually be ignored, or might end up being labelled as spam, damaging your email address.
But before dropping such a hint, check their linking policy - if that does not conform with this advice (especially if they link to non-related sites or cr*p sites) - then don't even think about linking; the very last thing you want is to join a bad neighbourhood - even one with a green bar attached.
With links these days, it's always Quality - not Quantity. A site with 15-20 good links can almost invariably outrank one with 5000 cr*plinks, in most niches.
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g1smd
Staff
Joined: Jul 28, 2002
# Posts: 10465
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Posted: 2008-Jan-16 12:56
Links to you are vital. However, those links that are from sites that are off-topic, or are links that appear to have been paid for, or have rel=nofollow on them, or are part of a link farm, or come from a dubious site, will not be helping you.
You should be linking out to sites that your visitors would find useful, not linking out to sites just because they link to you. Google often discounts reciprocal links from their calculations, so that the other sites link to you doesn't count, and if their site is dodgy, then the act of you linking to it, does start to harm your own site.
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beth_lk
Staff
Joined: Jun 23, 2004
# Posts: 1308
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Posted: 2008-Jan-16 22:01
OK - I am embarrassed about all this - as I am to know this stuff - everything you all told me here is what I have always known to be true - BUT I was hoping I was missing something, as NO ONE will give me a link back to my site - NO ONE! 
why - well I can only assume as I am giving for free what others are making $ on - weight loss tips.
So I asked this "green horn" question in hopes I was missing something and that someone would assure me that links BACK to me were not that important ------ OK just call it a brain fart lol 
I know not to pay and links farms and content links out - I am cool with all that. It is getting anyone to link TO my FREE Weight Loss Tips site that has me going in circles.
I am going to put the site in my profile for now so you can see what I am up against ----- keeping in mind I know the site still needs work....
hence - don't do a site review ( yet ) lol 
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animated3d
Joined: Dec 22, 2005
# Posts: 443
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Posted: 2008-Jan-17 00:41
its a popular niche beth and if you write some good content with the right keywords in it, for sure there will be many who would link back to your site in time so Good Luck with it.
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beth_lk
Staff
Joined: Jun 23, 2004
# Posts: 1308
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Posted: 2008-Jan-17 02:31
in the past I have never "went after" any thing that was really competitive ---- and this time I did, so it is kind of like a whole new ball game for me.
Usually people are all but begging me to link to my sites, but not in this new field I ventured into lol
Getting links to me is so hard I have given serious thought to removing the site...
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animated3d
Joined: Dec 22, 2005
# Posts: 443
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Posted: 2008-Jan-17 07:31
an honest opinion i would give is, it needs just a tiny itzy bit more content, and i know about all those talk how directory links are worthless but i dotr believe in that
they are like ants one or a few can be considered nothing but a dozen or more do give some pushing to it(ranking)or dont worry to link some of your older sites to this one if they are on different hosting ips
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Prowler
Staff
Joined: Aug 14, 2000
# Posts: 1829
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Posted: 2008-Jan-17 08:45
There are still some quality directory sites out there with human editors. If you are willing to spend some time hunting them up and submitting to them under the right category, you will have some decent inbound links.
You can start your search for such directories here: [link]
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Quadrille
Joined: Nov 15, 2000
# Posts: 1064
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Posted: 2008-Jan-17 11:54
Directory links are NOT like ants - it isn't quantity you need, but Quality Directories.
You could submit to thousands of cr*p directories, and get no benefit at all (indeed, if you reciprocal linked, you could do yourself serious harm). Equally, you could be accepted by 2 or 3 Quality directories, and it could have a visible impact.
ODP alone can turn a site around.
Many of those listed by vile silencer demand a reciprocal link; unless the list has been updated recently, 50% of the directories listed (at least!) are trash.
If you value your site, be fussy. Choose carefully and save time - and minimise risks.
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beth_lk
Staff
Joined: Jun 23, 2004
# Posts: 1308
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Posted: 2008-Jan-17 18:18
I thought of going through directories ( good ones ! ) but also thought individual web sites would bring me more "luck" which is not happening ------- I thank you all for the directory directions and will head off that way
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animated3d
Joined: Dec 22, 2005
# Posts: 443
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Posted: 2008-Jan-17 20:28
you are welcome beth if you just google "weight loss directory" you will find a lot of them that are specifically for that
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beth_lk
Staff
Joined: Jun 23, 2004
# Posts: 1308
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Posted: 2008-Jan-18 01:38
duhhhhhhh - EGG on my face - like I said I am suffering from major brain fart this week 
Thanks animated
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jibikao
Joined: Jan 18, 2008
# Posts: 5
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Posted: 2008-Jan-18 16:08
I have some questions related to this topic.
How exactly do you know if that website is a "quality" website that you can link to and get a link back? By Pagerank?
My website sells self defense products and if I can find a Blog that talks about self defense weapons, is that "quality" enough?
And also, my friend told me that I should not link to website that has lower pageranking than my website 'cause that will "bring me down". Is this true? The page ranking I am talking about is the Green bar. I am not sure if there is other "page ranking" out there. For example, I sell some Makarov stuff and there is a makarovdotcom that sells nothing but makarov stuff but my page ranking is 4 and that website is 3. Would I bring down my page ranking or "popularity" by linking to that website?
PS: I did link to makarovdotcom eventually because I feel my customers can benefit from reading all the makarov info that I don't have on my website. I figure if they go there and read, I can reduce the # of phone calls or emails. lol
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Quadrille
Joined: Nov 15, 2000
# Posts: 1064
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Posted: 2008-Jan-18 16:32
Linking to a 'lower PR page' will not do you harm, unless the page has 'gone bad' since the green bar was last updated - what you see is always 3-6 months out of date. "Real" pr is known only to Google; you see an old snapshot.
PR is a pretty limited way to judge 'quality', partly for that reason.
When you review a site, look for spam - or spammy - signs.
Look at THEIR linking policy - if they are unfussy, they are at risk; link to them and you are too.
Would you recommend them to a friend? If not, then walk away.
Look at the code, too.
There's many, many warning signs, but sometimes it just doesn't seem right - so walk away.
Assessing sites gets easier with practice, but it's still more art than science.
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jibikao
Joined: Jan 18, 2008
# Posts: 5
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Posted: 2008-Jan-18 16:48
So basically, if that website doesn't seem "spammy", I can link to it even if it has lower ranking than mine (as long as the content is related)?
What about commercial to commercial websites. Two websites that sell self defense products and we agree to link to each other. Are we helping each other or no?
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Quadrille
Joined: Nov 15, 2000
# Posts: 1064
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Posted: 2008-Jan-18 17:37
Google doesn't discriminate between commercial and non-commercial.
A link is a link. You need to be careful who you link TO, as SEs deem you to be 'responsible' for those links. Careless reciprocal links can therefore damage your rankings.
Related links are fine, so long as the related site is OK.
Paidlinks are NOT fine, but that's another issue.
The only problem I can see with commercial to commercial, is the temptation to do the same with 100 sites, who are all doing the same thing - that's then seen as a linkexchange, and the links will likely be discounted. Plus if ANY of those sites are rotten, the bad neighborhood will spread to all.
Google finds it hard to believe that one site will 'recommend' 100 rivals, who all 'recommend' each other. Me too
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kynduvme
Joined: Apr 18, 2001
# Posts: 977
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Posted: 2008-Jan-18 17:55
The rule of thumb for inbound links is, relevancy and quality. Do not buy them find them and reciprocate. You can have 100 and get great results if google counts them and they are relevant and high quality.
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jibikao
Joined: Jan 18, 2008
# Posts: 5
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Posted: 2008-Jan-18 19:00
The tough part is finding a good related website that would link to your website.
When you say "paid links", does it mean like those services that link to your website even though they have nothing to do with the nature of your website? Like Link-Blaster or something?
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