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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/12/2004 09:14 am
I am writing concerning one of the members who holds an account with your search engine. I was recently "suspended" from their program "So White The Dove" for being "dishonest" scotian 2004-10-17 Dishonest I had marked "search" as an interest in my preferences to receive emails from them for searches. I have done some searches, although they claim I have not. I feel I should not be "obliged" to do searches if I do not wish to. I get paid to "read" the email sent and that's it. I don't want to feel as if I am FORCED to search which is what So White The Dove has done to its members. I will copy and paste emails that have been exchanged with myself and the owners of So White The Dove prior to them deleting me from their program. They have done this to many of their members who reached payout. They are not only suspending/deleting people for not searching, they are giving them extra money FOR searching which is definately "incentivizing" searches. That should not be allowed... I know search feeds would NOT be happy to know this about this affiliate... Here are some of the emails we have exchanged back and forth... name: xxxxx> > username: xxxxxxxxxx > > bquestion_type: Suspended Account? > > message_type: Okay I must say I am very appalled at my account being > suspended??? In all of 2 1/2 years of doing GPTR, I have NEVER been > called "dishonest"...would you kindly explain why I have been suspended > right after I put in for my payout? > > I have no cheat software and I read and understand English very well... > > I am very hurt that you would consider me "dishonest"???? > > Thank you for your time... > Their response: Sunday, October 17, 2004 9:31 AM Dear xxxxxx You have promoted our site hardly. I really appreciate it. It's really a pity that your account got suspended. because you marked "search" in your account info, but I haven't found you perform a valid search so far. that's why your account got suspended. What should you do if you were me? I need your suggestion about this situation. All my love, Annie & David My response: Sunday, October 17, 2004 10:29 AM Yes, I have promoted your site heavily and even bothered to create a personal webpage for it...I always promote heavily programs I am a member of...I am only in 12 programs... Now, are you SURE that I have never done any searches for you? Searches are not suppose to be incentivized in any way...Sometimes I try to do searches and the search limit has been exceeded... This matter will be left up to you...you are the program owner...I am simply the member... But, I will say that I have read over the TOS once again and did NOT break any of the terms that would warrant your account to be deleted or suspended... Many programs have suspended members before at payout for not searching but in the end, it makes matters worse...I am simply telling you that if the "wrong" person gets suspended for not performing searches, you will be at risk of losing your search accounts cause some people would not hesitate to report incentivized searching...I have seen it done many times...sadly enough...also, this is not listed in the TOS 
I am not that type of person that would stoop to that level, but, many would... Again, I will leave this situation up to you... I am NOT a dishonest person...actually, I am in a competition with a police department right now and my interview is Wednesday...so, how dishonest am I with 5 years experience working with the police already??? Thank you for your time.. Their response: Sunday, October 17, 2004 12:45 PM Dear xxxxxx Have you read our FAQ? [link] Do you know how much I wanted to pay you? the owners of search engines I have joined help me to check my account. but hadn't found even one valid search from you IP. if I even found one I would not hesitate to pay you. how could you say I force anyone to search? I only ask the members don't mark "search" if they have no interest in searching. That's all. All my love, Annie & David My response: Sunday, October 17, 2004 1:10 PM Please unsuspend me from your program so I can go in and delete my account...I NO longer wish to be a member of your program...and will gladly delete myself from it in a hurry... You are just as dishonest as I am... Next time it may be wise to put something in the TOS so others don't go through this as well... My response again: Sunday, October 17, 2004 2:08 PM By you have "suspended" my account means that you have penalized me for "not searching" and that means you are "incentivizing" your searches... This is a "get paid to read email" program and I read every email you send...yes, every single one of them...the few admin mails you've sent were read by myself as well... And I have been familiar with search engines for a couple of years now and know how they operate...actually, am a member of several search engine programs myself...Carol from Mec-Co-Op had started doing that and guess what? She got in trouble...she started being reported for suspending her members for not searching as then it becomes "incentivized"...a search is there for IF a person wants to search...I get paid to read the email...any email that comes in, I read...also, some search feeds are really cracking down from allowing certain countries, provinces from searching...although I AM from a search country, often I am not ABLE to search as it says my IP is not permitted to... I don't think there is much you could teach me about search engines...I've studied the way they work for quite some time now and considered getting scripts for one as well...I also have many friends that own and operate search engines themselves...they would NOT be happy to know that members are being suspended for not searching as you are not suppose to force (in this case, suspend) members...and that is what you are doing in your program...it's very sad indeed as I really thought you would have a great program...I see now, a few weeks too late, that you won't...unfortunately...also, I know that search engines do NOT work with GPTRs in helping them see if certain IP numbers are searching...they don't do that...trust me, I can name you about 10 webmasters/webmistresses right now that can verify that for me, and a couple have already so please be honest with yourself... Their response: Tuesday, October 19, 2004 8:42 AM Dear Tina, Sorry for the delay. We were busying ourselves in catching honest members. we are proud of having so many honest members. They not only got their earnings but also won our special reward which we named "Honesty Prize". The first winner got his prize on OCT. 9. Since you said "I read every email you send", then I have a question, have you read this email "Important--Please read" which we sent on Oct 4? If you read this email you would have no doubt of my honesty or you should complain that time not this time. but you didn't send any message to us until your account got suspended. not only we sent an email to state this question but also on the sign up page we ask everyone who wants to join SWTD to read our FAQ & TERM from Oct. 4. We have already catched many other dishonest members but I haven't met one like you who want to turn black into white, turn white into black. even threaten us. we haven't penalized you for "not searching", we have penalized you for "dishonest"! "it's very sad indeed as I really thought you would have a great program..." We really have a great program! it's very sad indeed as you didn't show us your honesty. Our site is the honest members's paradise, at the same time it is the cheater and dishonest member's hell. What on earth is it? depends... Your behaving is harmful not only to us but also the advertisers and other honest members. your behaving robbed the others of their benefit. BTW, if you email us next time, Please think it over first. We hope you could show us your honesty. All my love, Annie & David My response: Wednesday, October 20, 2004 11:16 AM Dear Tina, Sorry for the delay. We were busying ourselves in catching honest members. we are proud of having so many honest members. They not only got their earnings but also won our special reward which we named "Honesty Prize". The first winner got his prize on OCT. 9. I wonder how long they will remain there? Since you said "I read every email you send", then I have a question, have you read this email "Important--Please read" which we sent on Oct 4? If you read this email you would have no doubt of my honesty or you should complain that time not this time. but you didn't send any message to us until your account got suspended. not only we sent an email to state this question but also on the sign up page we ask everyone who wants to join SWTD to read our FAQ & TERM from Oct. 4. Yes, I did read all the admin emails since I've joined, there were only 2, 3 at the most...I did read the TOS a couple times as well...No, I had no REASON to email you prior to that as I was not having any problems...I don't email PO's just to say "Hello"  The instructions advises to email you within 7 days so that is why I emailed you...
We have already catched many other dishonest members but I haven't met one like you who want to turn black into white, turn white into black. even threaten us. Nowhere will you find I have threatened you in any way...so please don't take my words out of concept and see them as threats as they certainly weren't... we haven't penalized you for "not searching", we have penalized you for "dishonest"! You HAVE penalized me for not searching as that is the reason you gave me when I emailed you the first time so please don't go back on your words...I can provide you with the email you sent if you want your exact wording...and penalized me for not searching means that you are going against the TOS of ALL search engines you are a member of which means you are really risking getting your accounts deleted, and you may...and no, that is NOT a threat...that is how their TOS are and I have not written them up...odd that you didn't acknowledge in your email anything about what I had explained to you about the search engines...also, I know darn well that Search Engines DO NOT help PO's in seeing who has made searches and who has not as #1, that would be against your TOS as then you would be revealing private information, such as MY PERSONAL IP# and if you do that, then that would be against the law... "it's very sad indeed as I really thought you would have a great program..." We really have a great program! it's very sad indeed as you didn't show us your honesty. Our site is the honest members's paradise, at the same time it is the cheater and dishonest member's hell. What on earth is it? depends... No...you do NOT have a great program...you are FORCING people to search and those who don't search are being deleted from your program and called dishonest...you run a GET PAID TO READ PROGRAM and I READ the emails sent to me...I have NOT gone against your TOS...read them again... Your behaving is harmful not only to us but also the advertisers and other honest members. your behaving robbed the others of their benefit. I have nothing to do with "robbing" the advertisers...robbing is a "criminal offense" and I have not "robbed" anyone...I have been an advertiser myself and have paid good money to get my ads run, yes, and search engine advertising as well...the thing is, that being an advertiser myself, I KNOW that not everyone will search and before I purchase an ad for a search, I KNOW that I'm not going to make millions...some ads I have run I've gotten but a couple of clicks and I've taken the loss, that's what GPTR advertising is ALL ABOUT... BTW, if you email us next time, Please think it over first. We hope you could show us your honesty. You have seen my honesty...you just have not responded to my emails pertaining to the "content" of my email...you have given me an "indirect" response... Before you start talking about honesty, take a look at yourself...I have NOT gone against YOUR TOS...the ones YOU'VE written up for your program...in ANY way...you have NO right deleting members for what you are deleting them for and I fear some angry members that have been deleted from your program will retaliate...which will only, in the end, hurt your program even more... Ohhh and for the you owe me, since you don't pay your members the money they've earned, please donate it to a good cause...perhaps needy children, red cross, etc...hopefully you can use your better judgement on what a good cause is...I don't need your money...I don't need anything from you...and you do NOT have to respond to me any further...I owe you nothing, you owe me nothing...I have tried to delete myself from your program but have been unable to...please delete me from your program...I am requesting to be deleted... They no longer responded to me and I then sent this: Friday, October 22, 2004 6:01 PM Upon further studying in this matter...I find you guilty of being "dishonest" in your own program... When you select the interest of Search, the advertisers are paying for you to utilize the resources of the search engine and search for something that is of interest to you. That is why it is called TARGETED. If you purchase advertising to promote your portal page, it means you aim at sending VISITORS. VISITORS to your site should be free to decide if they want to make a search and what they want to search for. Affiliates who don't comply with the Terms and/or the rules set forth above will loose their account without warning. From Boeze.com's FAQ Q: Do you allow incentivized searches? A: NO, incentivized searches are strictly prohibited. Any member who uses these practices their account will be terminated and will result in forfeiture of all money owed. This includes charity searches and search exchange too. Activities that are NOT allowed: Portal, Banners Or Search Box on Non-English Content Websites. Portal, Banners Or Search Box on Any Websites/Pages that are Just A List of Searchboxes and Advertising Self Clicking & Abuse of Dynamic IP Address< Search Exchange or Begging for Searches: you are NOT allowed to beg, or use incentive text to advertise us (such as "please make a valid search" 
Paid To Click Advertising Clicks from Open Proxy Server or Use of Click Bot Search with No Referring URL: All searches must be from search box or portal page that are located from your site. From ZiffyQuest's FAQ's Quote: What will happen if I'm caught spamming or cheating? We have a zero tolerance policy towards spamming or cheating. Anyone found using open proxy servers, traffic bots, search exchanges, targeting keywords or using incentive searches will have his account deleted with forfeiture of any funds in his account! 1. it is againt almost all if not all SE TOS for there promoters to advertise on a site that forces searches. Therefore advertisers are going to stop buying your search ads. And if the SE find out you are forceing members to searches you will be added to their list of banned ad sites. And they will find out as I am sure this email will be forwarded to them. 2. Many members whether they promote SE or not will not look kindly on this practice. This exact same problem is happening at xxxxxxxx now...the only difference is...that the PO was honest enough in recognizing that this would be wrong...to suspend or delete members for not searching as it IS against all the TOS of Search Engines and she knew that she would lose most of her advertisers...also, for any advertiser with ads running in a program that enforce this, the advertiser also risks his/her account to be deleted... So, to make a long story short...t'was not I who was being dishonest...we are paid to READ and VISIT sites...we are NOT paid to search...it is a tool we can use if we WISH to use it...just like we are paid to visit other sites...we are not OBLIGED to purchase candles from a site if we don't want, nor would we be called "dishonest" if we didn't...you are NOT treating your members fairly...your program WILL not survive and you will NOT have happy members... And THAT is my final answer... YOU ARE CHEATING YOURSELF AND YOUR MEMBERS... So, I have not received any more responses from them. I have been deleted from their program about 4 days ago though, now for being inactive I guess, as I was not able to log into their program to delete myself or do anything about it. A friend of mine who is also a member of the program was kind enough to pass me their affiliate ID's so I could report them to the search engines they are a member of. I don't think this sort of behaviour is "fair" or "professional"...where they actually tell me that they work with PO's of search engines to see if people are searching is such a lie. That would mean they would be giving out people's IP #'s which of course would be against their own TOS as they are not to give out any private information from their members to ANYONE. I am asking that this person be "removed" from any search engine programs they belong to as they are breaking the rules. They are forcing people to search and if they don't search, they are suspending them and then deleting them...You can find a whole list of them here: Abnormal Account List Username Suspended Reason ange3738 10-30 Inactive agnetasch 10-27 Dishonest alamomoney 10-30 Inactive angelarwyn 10-27 Dishonest auzmum 10-27 Dishonest blessed2004 10-27 Dishonest bsiljander 10-30 Inactive captmurdoch 10-27 Dishonest carolyn77 10-30 Inactive cdown55 10-30 Inactive csies71 10-30 Inactive dholmes000 10-30 Inactive domdom 10-30 Incorrect userinfo dove2011 10-30 Inactive dwinchell 10-30 Inactive edperu 10-30 Inactive eener51557 10-30 Inactive ehsan26142 10-30 Incorrect userinfo esi 10-30 Incorrect userinfo estelle 10-30 Inactive fundsurfer 10-30 Inactive germanchick 10-27 Dishonest gmaurel 10-27 Use autoclick software guowei1983 10-30 Not from accepted countries hashq 10-30 Inactive hillqf 10-30 Not from accepted countries hong7 10-27 Dishonest include 10-30 Inactive jeanne1006 10-27 Dishonest jimwaters 10-30 Inactive jlbabbitthotmail 10-27 Dishonest jodero 10-27 Dishonest kdhof 10-27 Dishonest kefrec 10-27 Dishonest kellysunshine 10-30 Inactive killa 10-27 Use autoclick software malewis48 10-26 Dishonest moneymaker 10-27 Dishonest mrsblackross 10-27 Dishonest nennie 10-27 Dishonest pmormr 10-27 Use autoclick software priscinadia 10-30 Inactive shadowette 10-27 Use autoclick software shayesteh 10-30 Inactive shenguoming 10-30 Not from accepted countries shitmail 10-30 Not from accepted countries shoekeys 10-27 Dishonest sin23323 10-30 Inactive strdsthotmail 10-30 Inactive suec517 10-27 Dishonest swan0002 10-27 Dishonest wer 10-30 Not from accepted countries xiaotianya 10-30 Not from accepted countries yuancs 10-30 Inactive Username Suspended Reason Canceled 1122aa 10-19 Inactive 10-27 69domy69 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 aaheather2003 10-19 Inactive 10-27 aboandjan 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 adelaar16 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 adrianom3 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 akonsta 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 alangef 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 alireza111 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 apfel 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 arefnet 10-19 Inactive 10-27 audi83080 10-19 Inactive 10-27 aziz3dux 10-19 Inactive 10-27 azor 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 baty6816 10-03 Cheat links 10 times 10-16 bernardcbch 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 bevmba 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 biguglyboy 10-19 Inactive 10-30 billsmith 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 breakersx 10-19 Inactive 10-30 brides 10-19 Inactive 10-30 birne 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 blackalex 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 blackdead 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 bobby008in 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 born2bwon 10-19 Inactive 10-27 brutm 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 buchmosaik 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 bull33 09-25 Cheat links 13 times 10-03 calixta 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 carey96md 10-19 Inactive 10-30 carolynf 10-19 Inactive 10-30 catperson2314 10-19 Dishonest 10-30 cavoz 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 cherub 10-19 Inactive 10-27 cleopata26 10-19 Inactive 10-27 cookie551 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 crazyclick 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 d11estiny 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 dale102 10-19 Inactive 10-30 dangus 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 dmpcash 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 doggy1 10-19 Inactive 10-30 ducklover8302 10-19 Inactive 10-27 dunphy 10-03 Cheat links 4 times 10-16 elise2704 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 evilc1064 10-19 Inactive 10-27 fastpig000 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 fatmir 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 fred093 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 fredg 10-19 Inactive 10-30 free347 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 froschi69 10-09 Dishonest 10-19 gagneurs 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 gaint 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 ginagal44 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 gsk100f 10-19 Inactive 10-27 halsten 10-19 Inactive 10-30 heatherwang 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 hermione 10-19 Inactive 10-30 hjalmarlucas 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 hls74 10-19 Inactive 10-30 hunterharris 10-19 Inactive 10-27 iampsikick2 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 imranahmed 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 jcbeasley 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 jean 10-19 Inactive 10-30 jlamb 10-19 Inactive 10-30 jmcguire30 10-19 Inactive 10-30 joe307 10-19 Inactive 10-30 joenny 10-03 Cheat links 3 times 10-17 josevte 10-19 Inactive 10-30 juliaspindler 10-19 Inactive 10-30 kacy 10-03 Cheat links 4 times 10-16 k386trl 10-19 Dishonest 10-30 kermit 10-19 Inactive 10-30 kgorski 10-21 Dishonest 10-30 killworld 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 kira 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 krissyaviles 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 kville707 10-19 Inactive 10-30 leemine 10-19 Inactive 10-30 leguh 10-19 Dishonest 10-30 leon119 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 libex 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 linda1987 09-25 Cheat links 27 times 10-03 lmonline24 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 loudor2001 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 love696969 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 lynzeerae88 10-19 Inactive 10-30 m1a2r 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 masoodsaeed 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 marcj 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 marifran 10-19 Inactive 10-30 marioraja 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 maus00084 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 mbyz 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 megapool 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 micha1108 10-19 Dishonest 10-27 michellelove 10-19 Inactive 10-27 mickekarp 10-19 Inactive 10-27 mickyhoops 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 mmckin1234 10-19 Inactive 10-27 moonspirit 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 mucahit 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 muratbelgin 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 nightwhisper200 10-19 Inactive 10-27 nikju1 10-19 Inactive 10-27 nmdcdn 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 nonni991 10-17 Dishonest 10-26 nvgu77 10-19 Inactive 10-27 pace78921 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 panoen 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 patrickbm 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 pattieb 10-19 Inactive 10-27 pawelll21 10-19 Inactive 10-27 peyj 10-19 Inactive 10-27 pietnegen 10-19 Dishonest 10-27 pinkfloyd 10-19 Inactive 10-27 pjbisch48 10-19 Inactive 10-27 pookie92 10-19 Inactive 10-27 poppie5 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 psrhonnie2 10-19 Inactive 10-27 psxl 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 pwiechowski 10-19 Inactive 10-27 qisile7777 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 ramaword 10-19 Inactive 10-27 raminaccount 10-19 Inactive 10-27 renae172 10-19 Inactive 10-27 rexjerry 10-03 Cheat links 10 times 10-16 rhiannon72 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 ritejeni 10-19 Inactive 10-27 rixand 10-19 Inactive 10-27 robatkapa 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 rottekone 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 ruedi41 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 rv 09-25 Cheat links 9 times 10-03 ryan9254 10-19 Inactive 10-27 sampsons 10-03 Cheat links 6 times 10-16 scotian 10-17 Dishonest 10-26 shenlan 10-09 Use autoclick software 10-19 shiva69 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 smailer 10-19 Inactive 10-27 smith1287 10-19 Inactive 10-27 smr3969 10-19 Inactive 10-27 snoopie 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 snoopy2910 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 sparky246 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 sparks78 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 stevelowe 10-19 Inactive 10-27 stge72 10-07 Dishonest 10-16 stompy 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 sventaylor 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 sw 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 tandaw 10-19 Inactive 10-27 tanja 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 taoaiming 10-19 Inactive 10-27 tierre0 10-13 Dishonest 10-26 thedarkside 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 theilluminati 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 thierry74 10-19 Inactive 10-27 tim 10-17 Dishonest 10-26 toontownjim 10-19 Inactive 10-27 toptep 10-19 Inactive 10-27 tracey 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 trend 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 tryitdon 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 vap9999 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 veratirk 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 vic37 10-19 Inactive 10-27 viva1320 10-19 Inactive 10-27 vpl104 09-25 Cheat links 21 times 10-03 waxman 09-25 Cheat links 7 times 10-03 werty018 10-09 Can't read English 10-19 whitebird 10-19 Inactive 10-27 whitekimba 10-19 Inactive 10-27 wildclaw 10-22 Dishonest 10-30 wildghost 09-25 Cheat links 4 times 10-03 willg 09-25 Cheat links 5 times 10-03 wiseria1431 10-19 Inactive 10-27 xavier751 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 xlovex 10-19 Inactive 10-27 xorex 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 xxxkkk 10-13 Inactive 10-26 yourbubble 10-19 Inactive 10-27 zjawcia 10-19 Inactive 10-27 zpasta 09-25 Cheat links 6 times 10-03 zyp2000 09-25 Cheat links 3 times 10-03 Copyright © 2004 SoWhiteTheDove.Com - All Rights Reserved Site Design by SoWhiteTheDove.Com Powered by CashCrusader These are the links that were given to me by another member of So White The Dove so I could report them for their actions: [links removed] Thank you for your time, scotian You may read more info here: [links removed] or here: [links removed] Thank you for reading... scotian |
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flyingrose Moderator
Joined: Oct 30, 2003
# Posts: 3361
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Posted: 11/12/2004 01:52 pm
The key to the entire exchange above is this quote: "You are just as dishonest as I am..." I challenge anyone to explain why a legitimate business would want to pay people to READ ads. Ask any advertiser the purpose of their advertising. If you find one that says they just want someone to read them and they're happy to spend money for that purpose have them contact me about a bridge for sale. Many want to find new ways to make money. The path to success is to provide a service that truly benefits others. To determine if something is worthwhile and legitimate, ask yourselves what benefit is being provided and who is being benefited. Also ask yourself whether your participation is detrimental to anyone. Ads are intended to generate SALES so how do you suppose clicking on ads with no intention of taking action affects the advertiser? |
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/12/2004 02:02 pm
Okay BUT if I am clicking on a mail for a candle site, should I be or feel forced to purchase candles? I am paid to view/read the site ONLY! Same as search engines...I should NOT be forced to make this search! I have been suspended for not searching when in fact, I have searched in that program WHEN I NEEDED TO...it's a tool, it's not something I SHOULD be forced to do! In fact, it's NOT something that you are forced to do... Have a good night |
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/12/2004 02:14 pm
Within the Paid to Read 'industry' people are just paid for reading the email, they click the link within the email to go to the page in question being advertised, and stay there for X number of seconds to view the site. Even when search portal pages, or a link to the search engines page, are sent out, you are just being paid to go to that page and not to make a search. However, there are some, such as this site, which force members to search by either telling them to or making statements such as that. Or, they go on about how the point value within their site will be more if people search. Most of the search engines that allow their links to be advertised through Paid to Read sites follow the rules given to them by their feeds, but some also dont follow them and recently, a list of sites, both search engine and paid to read, were banned by at least two of the main feeds that supply the search engines. The feeds are aware of the paid to read industry. This thread I have started here is my way of letting them, and others, know just what is happening that shouldnt happen. |
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flyingrose Moderator
Joined: Oct 30, 2003
# Posts: 3361
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Posted: 11/12/2004 03:28 pm
My point is that the person who is being "paid to read" and the company paying them are benefiting financially at the expense of the advertiser who is being charged. They are parasites. That everyone is aware of this shady industry does not mean they condone it or would not stop it if they could. That advertisers are aware that some percentage of their advertising dollars are going to be a waste of money in this way does not mean that they won't continue to advertise and receive the benefits of the real potential buyers they pay to come to see what they offer. You are complaining that a company has taken advantage of you - a company that exists only to take advantage of advertisers. Does this truly surprise you? I am aware that many who join pay to read and pay to click programs do not realize the implications of their actions. |
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/12/2004 03:35 pm
I don't agree with parts of your post...sorry
If someone advertises something in a newspaper and someone buys that paper, they are being paid to read the paper, are the people that read that paper parasites as well? I believe you are being "ignorant to the fact" that I got deleted from a program that incentivizes searches... I wasn't complaining about it really, just wanted to apprise other people about my situation and what happened... It's not the fact that I got suspended or deleted, it's what they are DOING to members of their program which is strictly forbidden as per the TOS of search engines... |
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underlingfashions Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 1
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Posted: 11/12/2004 03:54 pm
To quote something of yours flyingrose: "That advertisers are aware that some percentage of their advertising dollars are going to be a waste of money in this way does not mean that they won't continue to advertise and receive the benefits of the real potential buyers they pay to come to see what they offer. " If Advertisers want to advertise through someone's Paid to Read website that is their choice. The issue is when you have sites such as this one forcing people to search who arent wanting to search for something via PPC Search Engines. That is ripping the advertiser off because they want people who are interested in buying something from their site, which is why they are advertising their site either directly through the search engine in question, or the feed that supplies that search engine. In the example given above in reguards to newspapers, people reading newspapers arent parasites, they buy the paper for something to read. They arent being forced to buy something or to call any of the advertisers that advertise through the site. As to the Paid to Read industry being shady, it's only shady because there are such sites as this that force people to search. It's these sites which make the industry shady. There are a few that are quite legit in their methods, of course the shady sites far out number them and if Search engine owners and feeds that frequent this forum were made aware of such sites they might help make a difference. Just to add, if search engines and feeds were willing to blacklist these shady sites, and sites which cause harm to this industry, it would help greatly. Some search engines and feeds have blocked traffic from some sites, but there isnt enough sites being blocked that need to be blocked. |
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/12/2004 04:00 pm
underlingfashions, Thank you for your post and support in this matter...I believe you understand exactly why I have started this post
Thanks again! |
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flyingrose Moderator
Joined: Oct 30, 2003
# Posts: 3361
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Posted: 11/12/2004 07:47 pm
I understand that you got deleted from a program that is designed to take advantage of advertisers and ignores the rules of the search feeds. My point is why would you expect them to treat their participants any better than they treat anyone else? If an advertiser CHOOSES to advertise in this manner and hopefully is being honestly told what they are buying that is one thing. What I object to is when the advertiser's ads are being included in these programs without their knowledge. They are being defrauded of advertising dollars by these pay to click programs. The company PAYS when people search and that search returns the ads of advertisers who are NOT participating knowingly in this program. The company and the people they pay to search are benefiting at the expense of the advertisers. Your newspaper example is comparing apples and oranges. How did the person get PAID to read the paper? They had to buy it. Pay to read clicks directly cost the advertisers money; who does or does not choose to buy the paper does not. Whether they push their participants to search or not, the PAYMENT for searches in itself is incentivizing search. I consider both to be behaviors that take advantage of others and therefore something I personally will avoid. null |
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/13/2004 11:01 am
Regarding this matter, I have finally received a response from TapirSearch via the GetPaidForum...they advised that they did not read the email I sent them because once they saw my text, there was too much English and they gave up!! Read more here: [link] How can they offer suport to their members while running a search engine if they cannot understand English well enough? Or, is this simply their way of "ignoring" my situation? Very sad indeed! |
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/13/2004 02:12 pm
TapirSearch has worked with me on this matter... They have suspended the account of the person in question... |
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/13/2004 04:46 pm
Boeze Search has also worked with me on this matter... They have banned the account of the person in question... |
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MJR Moderator
Joined: Dec 12, 2000
# Posts: 2163
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Posted: 11/16/2004 01:22 am
I'm not even sure if this is the correct forum for this thread, however it very interesting to say the least. Regardless of which side of the fence you are on with this issue it is very enlightening. Just another side of the PPC industry that the PPC owners need to deal with. I think I'll get a little more information before I'll offer my opinion |
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highway61r Joined: Oct 19, 2004
# Posts: 15
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Posted: 11/23/2004 06:54 pm
""Whether they push their participants to search or not, the PAYMENT for searches in itself is incentivizing search."" - - - I just would make an observation here on this comment above, as it is the Very Means, on which the whole of the Current System thrives. 1- The Feeds, (ALL Second Tiers), Strictly Demand, that the Search Engines they are Feeding Results To, Do NOT permit 'Incentivized' Traffic. *This puts the Feeds, in the Clear. They are ''not at fault'' for any incentivized traffic, that may land at their advertisers websites. They are 'doing their part'.* Or So, it would 'Appear', which is the Whole of the 'system', as You'll see momentarily. 2- Most ALL, Third Tier PPC Search Engines, have Similar Text, on either their TOS or FAQ page, or Both. 'Incentivized' Traffic, is Not Permitted. *This puts the Third Tier ppc's, in the Clear. They are ''not at fauld'' for any incentivized traffic, that may land at their feeds Advertisers websites. They are 'doing their part'. Or So, it would 'Appear', which is the Whole of the 'system, as you'll Also see momentarily. 3- The Advertisers, Visit the TOS/FAQ pages, of the Feeds, and some even occationally Visit the advertising pages of the Third Tier ppc's TOS/FAQ pages as Well. In Both Cases, the Advertisers Leave the site, Assured, that their Advertising Budgets ARE Being Respected, and Protected, From, ''Incentivized'' Traffic, lol. Enter Bill! ""I s'ppose it Depends, on what your Definition of the word IS, IS"". The Third Tier PPC Search Engines, for the Most Part, Define 'Incentivized' as Follows: *You are NOT permitted to Beg, Plead, Demand, or Otherwise 'Incentivize' a member to do a search. *But Sending Paid Traffic, from paid to read email programs, to the 3rd tier se's affiliates search portal pages, 'IS', lol, Perfectly Acceptable, and occurs Hundreds of MILLIONS of Times each Week, throughout the vast network of ptrs, via the many 3rd Tier ppc's and their many affiliates. The Example cited by Scotian herein, IS the exception, not the rule. In Most All Cases, from Bottom, (the ptr clicker), Right to the Top, (feed), NO TOS Violation Takes Place. -the PTR Clicker, is NOT Violating the Terms of Service of the ptr program. *They are being Paid, to 'View the ''advertisers'' website. *If they choose to do a search, that's their business, Dispite, that Most Know, if they Don't, lol, the advertiser may Not come back, and they won't make as much money Next Week. -The PTR Program Owner, is NOT Violating the Terms of Service of the PPC Search Engine. *So Important, has this sole revenue source become to the ptr 'industry', term used here, apologetically loosely), that Most ptr wm's won't even Run an ad, that has 'incentivized Text', as defined above, in it, as this is a Direct Violation of the Terms of Service, of the ppc. *The PTR wm is running an ad, wherein the 'advertiser' is Asking the Clicker, to View the portal page, of the ppc they have affiliated with, nothing more, and is NOT in violation of the Terms of Service, of the PPC. -The Third Tier PPC, is NOT in Violation of the Terms of Service, of the 2nd Tier Feeds, that provide their Results, as the 3rd Tier engine owners ALL have the 'incentivized' statement, ON Their Websites, As Dictated by the Feed in the First Place. The Whole of the Success, of the Entire System, is Totally Dependent, on the ""Definition of the word IS, IS"" Model, of::: ""Profitable Mis-Interpretations"": Author Either UnKnown, or remaining Anonymous, for Obvious? Reasons... Now, of Course, the Feeds May, not Know this is happening, in which case, one would assert, that it ought be a simple matter of Contacting them, and having them Add to their TOS, that "Paid To Read Email Traffic, Is Strictly Prohibited"... Ya Know, Dispite ehe apparent Lack of understanding, from what I've seen to date, throughout the advertising community, of Why the roi is down so badly, they Do appear to be dropping the 2nd tiers like crasy, and one would Think? that at Least One of the Feeds, would Jump on this, and take the lead, but not to date. |
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beth_lk Insider
Joined: Jun 23, 2004
# Posts: 985
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Posted: 11/23/2004 07:20 pm
I own/run a work at home site - so this thread was of a great interest to me. I read all the posts here and looked over the actual web site. Right on the front page is listed all the reasons why a members may be suspended - that alone would make my shy away from this site! Then I read this ! Total Members: 647 Total Payouts: 7.35 647 people and a total of ONLY 247.35 paid out ! ???? Do the math...... It equals scam to me. So then I go to their payout page - the highest payout there is 3.80 !!!!!! ?????? My advice is to learn from this and just let it go...... Beth
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/24/2004 03:00 am
Fact of the matter STILL remains that SO WHITE THE DOVE suspended me "claiming" I did NOT perform searches and was dishonest for not performing them as I opted to receive searches as paid mail...Fact of the matter is that I DID perform searches when I NEEDED to look for something, when I knew I had not already done searches with that engine that day (if I remembered)...so they LIED when they said I did NOT perform any searches...I did when I could, when I felt the need to...I was suspended for not performing searches! They said they got together with owners of Search Engines to see if my IP # had any searches...that was another lie...they cheated many of their members...this was a wasy of "copping out" of paying me what I had earned...I did NOT go against any of their TOS and it was at no time mentioned that people who did not perform a search on EVERY SINGLE support link they sent (which is all they sent out by the way) that members would be suspended...had THAT been the case, I would never have joined a program like that...And then a couple of emails later for them to tell me that I was not suspended for "not searching" was a true lie as that is the reason they gave me in their very first email so they were then contradicting themselves... Very sad indeed... |
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openxs Joined: May 03, 2004
# Posts: 177
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Posted: 11/27/2004 12:52 am
I'm Lost. Are we talking about a PPC Search Engine or a GPTR Site? Well, if its a GPTR site, then you cant expect anything from them everyone knows how it all works. For more info on GPTR, visit getpaidforum.com |
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scotian Joined: Nov 12, 2004
# Posts: 10
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Posted: 11/27/2004 03:11 am
I'm not lost, I know how GPTR works and I also know how Search Engines work as well... I also know about the Get Paid Forum...that's where I posted my original thread about this situation |
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