I have a website that ranks decently for my line of work and it has been up since the end of January.

After looking through my logs recently, I discovered another website that doesn't even rank on Google that plagiarized the majority of one of my pages word for word.

The page that copied my page is: http://www.entsolconsulting.com/ENGGDRAFTING.htm

and mine is in my profile.

This webmaster/business owner even plagiarized a portion of my business name! Not only that, but most of the links on his page still link to my website.

Anyway, what is the best way of informing this individual that they are violating copyright?

Should I politely inform them to remove the page using email?

Or should I send them a letter by certified mail?

Should I even give them a warning?

I am willing to get my attorney involved if need be, but I prefer to make the first contact myself.

I also have all of the documents and electronic files available that prove this individual stole my layout and text so it would be very easy to prove if it ever came to a lawsuit.

Thanks in advance!

Andy

Unless you are actually losing money and can prove it as a direct result of what you allege was done, just going for principals does little more than make the Lawyers rich

Even if you went for copyright violation how are you going to evidentually prove who wrote the text first?

The words used on the pages are for the most part pretty generic

Remember litigation is a dollars and cents business, and actually proving what you allege is not always as simple as it would at first appear

Send them a polite email and see what happens

Don't waste money on it, in most cases that baby will be removed in fear.

The other point is that you should always know the enemy and what resources if any they have at their disposal before you start making legal threats

Regrettably these days people in all sort's of business's threaten to sue for this that and the other at the drop of a hat without fully realising the real life complexity and cost of doing so

One way to handle such a situation is to let the other side sue you! It is easier to defend an action than to prosecute, the evidential burdon being mainly on the plaintiff.

The above is just my personal view and should not be taken as to the giving of Professional legal advice

He's in the U.S., his hosting company is (apparently) in the U.S., and the major search engines are in the U.S. You send him a letter outlining the copyright violation, you send his presence provider a letter outlining the violation, and you send the search engines letters, too.

They're all legally obligated to act, unless he says he's willing to contest the accusation in court. The hosting company will even take down the site, and the search engines will delete his listings.

If he contests the accusation, and you chose to settle it in court, then you need a lawyer. At the letter-writing stage, you just need to search Google for "Digital Millenium Copyright Act", and learn how to write the accusatory letters.

I sure am happy that the server problem has been resolved. I thought I was going to have to repost my question.

With all due respect Linda, are you really saying that this individual's webpage http://www.entsolconsulting.com/ENGGDRAFTING.htm is not substantially identical to http://www.andysbestcad.com/services.htm?

Some of the minor differences between the pages are that my logo was removed, the company name was changed to Enterprise Solution Consulting at the top of the page and Andy's Best CAD was changed to Entsol Best CAD at the bottom of the page.

In addition, the 3 bookmarks, "HVAC", "Plumbing" and "Mechanical Fabrication" were removed and the bookmark "Architectural, Electrical and Fire Protection" was changed to "Architectural and Engineering Services".

It should also be noted that the bookmarks and the links on the plagiarized page still lead back to my website.

The contact information at the bottom of the page was also changed but all of the remaining content and layout was copied verbatim from my website.

I sent an email and a fax on Monday afternoon directing this individual to remove the offending webpage immediately. The email and fax included references to Title 17 of the Copyright Law of the United States Code.

As of today the offending webpage is still up and I have not received a response to my email or fax.

How long should I wait for a response?

As I said before I would prefer to not get the lawyers involved, but if after another letter goes ignored, then what are my options? I can only send so many letters.

I am going to forward my original email and fax to the individual's hosting company.

I will also research the Digital Millenium Copyright Act for further information as I wait for a response to my first email and fax.

Thanks again-Andy

I have taken a look at both pages.

You will see the source code on yours which is a basic HTML drafted document is vastly different from the other cited document which is drafted in what I believe is XML and very sophisticated in operation compared to yours.

The courts would be more interested in comparing source codes rather then the visual aspect of the documents. It is the source code that is the work of art, skill or talent of the author rather than the visual appearance, although I am not saying they would not take a look.

In your case their is a major difference in the code between documents.

I am not competant to discuss the coding of the other document as it is too complex for me, but their are experts around here that could assist in that respect.

I do see your page has meta tags for title description and keywords, but the other does not appear to have any.

btw the sequence of your tags looks back to front which can hurt during spidering

I would like to hear from any experts out there regarding the source code on the other document

Sorry Linda but I'd hardly call M$ Frontpage code bloat 'very sophisticated'.

Courts will compare not only source code but actual text and visual presentation. While it will take a combination of various factors to prove his case the links alone is their biggest downfall and proves that they copied the page from andy.

Andy - you do have a copy of this site don't you - if not you should. Don't only keep in on your hard drive but burn it to cd or copy it to floppy and mail it to yourself - keep it in the sealed envelope with a print out of the site and source and should it come down to going to court have the judge open it in court. The USPS stamp will verify date and time and is legal.

You should have CC'd the hosting company right off the bat. Research the DMCA - it's always good to speak intelligently

Most hosting companies will pull the content - you can read their TOS to see where they stand on this.

And what if the other webmaster mailed one to himself last week?

Andy, you are free to do what you wish, all I would suggest is that you think twice or three times before getting involved in any legal disputes because from what I can see your complaint however much valid amounts to little more than a principle at the present time although I do stand to be corrected. Anyway good luck

Why would someone mail a copy of a web site that THEY plagarized to themselves? That doesn't make any sense.

Whatever he decides to do, making the mailing is a good idea. At least it leaves his options open.

Why care? Any time someone tries to go anywhere on that site (which they'll have to do because the email information is broken), where do they end up? Andy's Best CAD. I find it somewhat ironic. I'd make it an issue after they fix their links. ;-)

I did copy the plagiarized page to my hard drive the second that I discovered it. I also printed out the source code, an actual copy of the page and screen shots with a date/time stamp at that time.

I will copy the page to a floppy and send that, a printout of the source code and a copy of the webpage and the screenshots to myself as suggested in case they are needed later.

Since I had not heard from the individual as of earlier today, I sent another email to the contact name listed as the registrant on whois.net. I also sent a certified letter earlier today to the contact listed on the website.

The previous emails, my fax and the certified letter made reference to Title 17 of the U.S. Copyright code and basically stated that he should remove the offending page immediately or further action would be taken.

I have not CC'ed the hosting company, but will take that action now. I should have done that from the get go.

I guess I am a little unclear as to what exactly constitutes plagiarism. I had always thought that the content and the printed text was the key for proving a violation and I understand now that it is probably a combination of many factors.

But it doesn't seem to make much sense to me to just compare the source code. I am thinking of a situation where an author uses Word to create a novel. Then another author comes along and uses WordPerfect to create a copy of that novel.

How could there not be a violation of copyright even though the published text and the visual presentation are clearly the same between the two novels?

I do find it somewhat amusing that the guy didn't even change the hyperlinks! Maybe I will see some added business from it but I hope that his 0/10 google ranked page doesn't bring my ranking down.

I just want a response from the individual at this point so I know where it stands.

Thanks again to all and hopefully it will get resolved soon-Andy

"I did copy the plagiarized page to my hard drive the second that I discovered it"

Prove it! (Using admissable evidence, bearing in mind most of the evidence you could come up with is, "multiple hearsay", and therefore normally inadmissable)

You could find out the culprit is located in say Japan or Bolivia and the alleged wrong was committed there. Which jurisdiction has power over the matter?

So you find out the culprit is within the U.S, and get him to court afer you have worked out which one,how do you prove he actually wrote the code and not his Kid Brother? He says he did not,you say he did, so how do you prove it using admissable evidence? ($$$$$$$$$$$$$$)

Did you register the document or webpage with the U.S Copyright office?

Remember this bit:

"In general, copyright registration is a legal formality intended to make a public record of the basic facts of a particular copyright. However, registration is not a condition of copyright protection. Even though registration is not a requirement for protection, the copyright law provides several inducements or advantages to encourage copyright owners to make registration.

Among these advantages are the following:
Registration establishes a public record of the copyright claim.

Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U. S. origin."

The culprit alleges You copied his work. Prove you did not, again following the strict rules of evidence!

Remember also that the evidence you can come up with is basically something anybody could draft using a simple keyboard and no signature(s) are involved. The culprit could say you prepared the second document yourself just to damage a competitor and you then have to spend money proving otherwise!

I did suggest earlier that it is more complex than one gives credit to when suing and the above problem areas are just the tip of the Iceberg

May I suggest you go easy, and do not make hasty decisions or threats you cannot follow up on to a conclusion

The excuse 'oh yea, it was my brother' to the court will sound a bit like 'the dog ate my homework' to a teacher. He's gonna have to do a lot better than that. LYING in a court of law, if he is proved wrong, could make a very nice result for Andy.

Andy - There is evidence but seeing as though he has PR0 and the links point to your site it is not a serious matter. Any phone numbers on his site? Ring him/her confront them and DEMAND they take your things off thier site and explain that you DO have evidence. The email address may be unused.

quote:

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Linda - He does have solid evidence of a direct copy of content with the links still pointing to his site!! He could print this post AND show them his logs 2

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I'd have to degree that he has much solid evidence. The closest thing he has is the fact that the links on his plagiarizer's site point back to him. Otherwise, there's not really any hard data that doesn't hold reasonable doubt as to its validity.

So if I possess electronic files of my webpages with a date and time stamp that is previous to the date and time stamp that appears in the source code of the plagiarized webpage, that is not sufficient enough to show proof of the alleged plagiarism?

Also, the website was registered with a U.S. address. Doesn't that make it covered by the U.S. Copyright code?

Linda, can you point me to the location of the following statement?

"Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U. S. origin."

I have been researching the copyright code and the DMCA, but have been unable to find this information.

Again, I just want a response from the individual and have not heard a word from him.

TIA-Andy

Oops, scratch that request regarding the registration requirement. That is covered in Section 411(a) of the Copyright code.

Thanks-Andy